--- title: Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite | TIME description: Techland sits down with Irrational Games Creative Director Ken Levine about the studio's upcoming project, BioShock Infinite. canonical: https://time.com/video/Eg00IhGA/ og:title: Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite og:description: Techland sits down with Irrational Games Creative Director Ken Levine about the studio's upcoming project, BioShock Infinite. og:url: https://time.com/video/Eg00IhGA/ og:image: https://cdn.jwplayer.com/v2/media/Eg00IhGA/poster.jpg?width=720 og:type: video.other twitter:card: summary_large_image twitter:title: Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite twitter:description: Techland sits down with Irrational Games Creative Director Ken Levine about the studio's upcoming project, BioShock Infinite. twitter:image: https://cdn.jwplayer.com/v2/media/Eg00IhGA/poster.jpg?width=720 --- # Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite > Sponsored content. 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They are at time.com/newsletters and are separate from a paid subscription. ## Video: Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite [Watch (HLS stream): Interview with Ken Levine about BioShock Infinite](https://cdn.jwplayer.com/manifests/Eg00IhGA.m3u8) (16:20)  _Published 2010-08-12. Techland sits down with Irrational Games Creative Director Ken Levine about the studio's upcoming project, BioShock Infinite._ --- Jul 27, 2023 2:24 PM UTC --- ## More From This Series [All Videos](https://time.com/video/) [Infinitely Polar Bear - Trailer](/video/PFLTmG2n/) ### Infinitely Polar Bear - Trailer [Irrational Games - Bioshock Infinite Trailer](/video/9jzENdBp/) ### Irrational Games - Bioshock Infinite Trailer [The Techland Show: The Prodigal Son Has Returned](/video/uw5O7WLQ/) ### The Techland Show: The Prodigal Son Has Returned --- ## Transcript -[ unk ] there's two key components and what makes a BioShock-- >> What is that it set in a world that is supposed to be fantastic and ridiculous and amazing and you just want to explore every nook and cranny but is also at the same time grounded in some way-- humanity unbelievable. And the other element is that it's a world where you-- it's a first- person shooter where you have huge range of tools and huge range of challenges and it's really up to you to drive how you deal with those challenges. And to be those of heart of any BioShock experience and to-- when, so we do wanna continue with those ideas. We knew we wanted to make another world. There's a lot of people don't-- I mean we're really, yeah that's what we did and then could go back to previous games we made, you know, we make games about world, it's really important with us to make that and not have the BioShock didn't seem right. You know, just because we were done with Rapture didn't mean we don't BioShock. I think that as a game industry, we have a very narrow view of what the sequels are, what franchise are. It's like 10 more weapons-- I mean how many sequels have you seen? It's 10 more weapons by about, you know, five more monsters. And that's easy to do, that's easy pitch, right? Like to mark, you know, I know that we showed this trailer yesterday and it's like, people are really amazing, it's [ unk ]. I don't-- wait, my head is kind of exploding a little bit and I get that and we expected that because it is a strange notion, right? It is a strange notion to follow on in a franchise but not following a few more stories. We noticed we've seen that happen a couple of franchise which really not a fantasy obviously. >> Right. >> And I think that's very bold and that sort of, that's one of the original inspirations for what we're doing because, you know, the expectation would have been, you know, your prequel, the Rapture-- this is not the mission that are rational. That's why we need the BioShock 2, you know. It wasn't the mission of this studio. The mission for us is to always learn from experience but at the beginning, learn-- the first time they saw BioShock, people were, " What is this thing? I don't quite get it ?" I mean, we have a lot of-- we have to overcome to explain what we're doing, explain what our mission was that if we don't have to-- if you don't have that [ unk ] at the beginning. If you don't have the sort of like-- what is this? Then you don't have that experience of a BioShock game, I think it's easy to forget now when people first saw the Rapture they were-- " What is this place? I don't get it. What is the-- what's happening here ?" And now it's sort of happening not just on with what world of Columbia. [ unk ] happened on a mid- level. >> Right. >> What we'd like to show you this game, and you never seen in the BioShock game-- okay, you're cool. You're this guy in this world and now there's all these questions about franchising this and that and those are meta questions and I get that. But I love those questions. You know, I think that it's important for us whatever ideas we have in these games is that they're not [ unk ] ideas. There are just some people can relate it to. I mean, you know in BioShock One, the ideas weren't as present today as in these ideas in this game are permanent but they are present to me and I want to get those ideas across. I think as we started the work on this game, the ideas we were talking about became more and more present in the dialog today, should it by chance and by accident and as because the [ unk ] of this ideas sort of come up often very often in the cycle of this story and, you know, so there's definitely a connection. They are terms of our creative process I think it's-- maybe unconsciously that happened because we happened so isolated and looking us has been strange, you know, I've been at, you know, dinner with you and I've not been able to talk about what we're doing. People asks us all the time and you wrote this line of, if this game has been the bottom line because our BioShock-- we know what we're doing. Nobody really cared, you know, we get it and now everybody cares and they wanna know and you have this huge concepts and expectations and you have the matters on your head also stay true your mission and focus on your mission and it's something we've deliver what people were expecting is easier but it's also at the end of the day, I think not fulfilling a mission in the studio. That's what we're out and getting to right now. I say, it has a lot of meaning. >> Yeah. >> And I think it's in the [ unk ] until people will actually play the game. They're not gonna understand fully what it means. I think one of the things you saw is I got really interested in at that point in what characters with you 'cause like Left 4 Dead there's a multiplayer but also there's a heart of emotions there of how the characters have somewhat what they have to say, you know, the character-- you know, especially the character say was really interesting that they sort of report on the game situation and they feel helpful to you. They interact with you in ways they give you information and help you even if they're controlled by somebody else things they say honestly and they're starting to have [ unk ] or just do directly on the team. >> Right. >> And that was really interesting to me because there were first to kinda play the game whether somebody with me that I felt was not just sort of what ornamentation. >> Right. >> And of and very effective ornamentations before and I really wanna say that was gonna be both effective narratively and effective from a game play standpoint. And, you know, if you're just looking at multiplayer games to get ideas from multiplayer games, you're not looking carefully enough. You can find great ideas from multiplayer and single player games. You can find great ideas for single experience as your multiplayer game. So, we learned the time. I learned the time, I always learned the time from guys like, you know Blizzard World of Warcraft even though I don't make massive multiplayer games and amount of player, if you will. >> Right. >> But there's just tons of ideas about the game play and about engagement that you get from those guys and I think a lot of, you know, somebody or their ideas about Elizabeth came about some of this character from Left 4 Dead but we also wanted a character that you have sort of an attachment to and also a compatible game play dynamic with. >> Right. >> And thus you never required to interact so she can never do anything on her own drive [ unk ], she never drive the situation on her own. You don't control her in any ways. We don't want swap mates it was nothing very interesting in making you there. But that you will have this sort of mutually beneficial relationship that she sets up these amazing things for you to do, which you can do. You know, all these things you saw last night that she helped you with and that she set up like a storm cloud-- >> Right. >> like the thing with the bridge, you could just ignore what she is doing and use your traditional suite of BioShock tools to deal with on your own. >> Right. >> She's a choice for you. >> So she'll never be a player- controlled at any point. >> Okay, which means you can-- single player experience? >> At the current time, even it is a single player if you ask a multiplayer sort of having the same thing which is similar ways in BioShock One which is-- if we have something to say then I'll do the player space that we think is compelling and is important and meaningful as what we were saying in the single player space then we'll do that. But it is not our mission to check the box. It never has been and that was-- we did in BioShock One. I'm checking that box, I don't get it but I don't think creatively that's right to do. I don't believe from a market standpoint, you're just doing some multiplayer mode to do it, check a box, nobody's gonna play that game. Well, I think it's a super, super hard challenge to come out as a multiplayer and that's gonna be successful. And that's why I've always felt that way and why I didn't have it in the first one. You never really know if you're gonna be successful. So DC to play, you know, the Monday morning quarterback. >> Yeah, yeah. >> But I think it's really, really challenging and that's why the only way I would do a multiplayer mode. I felt I have something really special need to say and you see that every two years. You see, you know, when, you know, Call of Duty comes and you see Left 4 Dead comes around. You see it every few years and it has to be a very special and important statement. That's an alpha. >> An Alpha? Is that a Bridge? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yeah, he's also in the trailer. >> We're not talking about that-- Why is the [ unk ] is not exactly from history? That didn't actually happen but certainly there was a feeling that we have the city from the Skyward from the start that was the one of the first ideas we had. The time periods first that the city in the sky. It was actually relatively recently that this notion sort of eight months ago or seven. The same phase similar happened on BioShock One we had a lot of ideas and then [ unk ] nomadic concept like the objective as BioShock One. This notion of that it's a-- there's notion of American exception, it was in this notion of the visual would be like [ unk ] is. I want this to feel like what people think July 4th 1900 felt like in main street America that [ unk ] the idealized memory of that and that's so different than what we have done before, you know, certain dark game underwater places. The sound just pouring in and brightness and color and flowers and all those elements which you just never seen in the BioShock game early before. That was something that were probably hard- striking probably different and for us the creative challenge to make a game that touches [ unk ] we want to without relying upon the dark and stormy that kind of look. I mean, we look to our guys like you know, David Lynch, one with you guys last time [ unk ] who were able to take that shining as in this antiseptic kind of fluorescent lit like this room, you know, a hotel and to make harder there is the challenge but it's also if you don't and this sort of mission that what we're trying to do, if you don't go again classifications at the beginning, I don't think you're really gonna fulfill invitations in the end. To me that time period was such a striking temper because you have-- imagine America, where you guys have last night? >> No. >> Okay. So like I'm talking about this last night, but imagine America in 1880, where it's basically farmland and where a-- we're insignificant in the world state. We don't really matter, not a world power and more basically an agrarian country and you have people raising cattle and crops and then you have 20 years later, in 1900, we have radio and television. Let's start-- we have radio and movies and automobiles, and electricity in houses and indoor plumbing and pornographs and all these since which to somebody in 1900, it would have been like you would tell them, " Hey, guess what? We saw this happen last 20 years. You think we can be living in the sky in five years ?" They do like, " Yeah, maybe ." That makes sense and you see all the arc in that time, all the science fiction of that time, a lot of it is like cities in the sky that was a big concept because they see that it makes sense. There's incredible optimism and technology. There's also incredible optimism in America coming out in a rural stage. It's like, " Oh, my God. We're this huge important country ." We're gonna start rejecting ourselves on the rural state and we can make a difference in the world. You know, we can bring these ideas to the world. You bring the certain American Democratic values and principle to the world and both of this is they're having the same time. And the third thing was like, BioShock, they're making-- there are many games about World War II and there are many games that, you know, set in the 60's or, you know, or later than that, very few games were set at that time but we like to touch on hundreds of people haven't rushed upon before. It's just a small [ unk ]. You know, again, it always make [ unk ] at the beginning. You know, Americans said, what-- 1960. I don't know why 1960? You know, it was about that. And, you know, seen here that this people don't know about it that we explore it 'cause it's so interesting and it's such a turning point in the country and in the world. You know, we really wanted to not in ourselves, some of the [ unk ] on ourselves before in this game as a sort of what a-- because again, to go against even in our own expectation is what we expect is in the game. I guess [ unk ] always some sci- fi, you know, some guy who doesn't have identity, really. I mean we use that the reason we get the BioShock, you know, we leverage that. But [ unk ] this time is that's not interesting for us anymore like we were making game where you really worst strong character and you have it with you or is it some guy giving you messages at the radio. You were still driving-- you know, the character was driving-- something, some of his own decisions. Not necessarily a player doing this decision but the character doing [ unk ] and I had, you know, one of the person I worked with Steve >> Right. >> You know, [ unk ] character. That's sort of one of the things I did and looking as kind of that character and the fact that you were talking and have a voice. That was a-- that I enjoyed doing and I thought it was effective and [ unk ]. Not a lot of people have [ unk ]. >> Right. >> And have also, I mean we look back and forth on this all that they were talking and you talking and having that dialog from the window and I don't know if I've seen much of that in the first- person shooter in terms of a really building a relationship, if that's relationship. Huge challenge for us but again, if you don't think on the huge challenges, it's harder at the beginning but worst at the end. I think it's, to me it's always-- there's also a bit of strangeness of this like, " oh, I'm like. We sure have this dual job which we were like telling the story. That's sort of your job and the sort of telling-- I have a job telling the story but also like, what happened to [ unk ]. How do I think that work? How do I think that the hype of story and how long the story [ unk ] the game play is worth where, you know, in a movie-- it's making musicals and it's like making traditional movies 'cause in musical they have this story problem like people start singing and dancing. >> Right. >> And they are certainly the same thing with the shooter right? We have the-- what people expect out of it, which is, you know, the combat. >> Yeah. >> And it's just challenging and interesting but also I think that because there's a problem, you know, like one thing I think we're doing is defying here what people expect out of in a sequel. >> Right. >> That's one of the thing they've been defying and one of the things that people were like, first thing I don't get it 'cause it's just-- sequel. [ unk ] are also the [ unk ] into what people expect out of an FPS side of thin. You know, what your role is, you know, having a clear unadulterated mission, you know, I am, you know, going into bad guys that and doing and blown up these dudes and that's very clear and I really understand that, you know, [ unk ] what you don't know that's going on. You don't have a clear, always have a clear sense in mission and part of that-- one of the front of this game, part of the front of this game is figuring out exactly what's going on here. So I am, you know, I would guess that I disagree with American that I think there's still plenty of fertile ground. There's nothing more media than first- person game. It is one of the world. There's nothing more --. No. I think we started this-- we started this probably out March of 2008, you know. So BioShock 2 was, you know, we didn't like it. It wasn't a reaction of BioShock 2. We knew do the time period of BioShock 2 we needed to be done and we knew this sort of what they wanted to do in terms of being Rapture and this wasn't the mission of our studio to make that game. >> Yeah. >> It was the mission of different studio and, you know, and they have it that well. We-- ours to do a different mission and we would have said-- we wanna save Rapture. It was time to do something that would really surprise people. >> Yeah. >> And make people go, " What the fuck ?" and that's what we do. 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