--- title: The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine | TIME description: TIME Senior Correspondent Simon Shuster and Editor-At-Large Karl Vick explain the intricacies within the two biggest geopolitical conflicts in 2023 and how the U.S. plays a role in the future of these wars. canonical: https://time.com/video/4GppEBmH/ og:title: The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine og:description: TIME Senior Correspondent Simon Shuster and Editor-At-Large Karl Vick explain the intricacies within the two biggest geopolitical conflicts in 2023 and how the U.S. plays a role in the future of these wars. og:url: https://time.com/video/4GppEBmH/ og:image: https://cdn.jwplayer.com/v2/media/4GppEBmH/poster.jpg?width=720 og:type: video.other twitter:card: summary_large_image twitter:title: The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine twitter:description: TIME Senior Correspondent Simon Shuster and Editor-At-Large Karl Vick explain the intricacies within the two biggest geopolitical conflicts in 2023 and how the U.S. plays a role in the future of these wars. twitter:image: https://cdn.jwplayer.com/v2/media/4GppEBmH/poster.jpg?width=720 --- * World # The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine > Sponsored content. 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They are at time.com/newsletters and are separate from a paid subscription. ## Video: The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine [Watch (HLS stream): The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine](https://cdn.jwplayer.com/manifests/4GppEBmH.m3u8) (8:48)  _Published 2023-11-14. TIME Senior Correspondent Simon Shuster and Editor-At-Large Karl Vick explain the intricacies within the two biggest geopolitical conflicts in 2023 and how the U.S. plays a role in the future of these wars._ --- Feb 15, 2024 5:20 PM UTC --- ## More From This Series [All Videos](https://time.com/video/) [U.S. Senators React to Intensifying Conflict Between Israel and Iran ](/video/MnoERXpW/) ### U.S. Senators React to Intensifying Conflict Between Israel and Iran [In Oval Office Address, President Biden Says Support for Israel and Ukraine is "Vital" for U.S. Security](/video/4j6SA0dC/) ### In Oval Office Address, President Biden Says Support for Israel and Ukraine is "Vital" for U.S. Security [Why Is Tennis Scored So Weirdly?](/video/lmEqspYj/) ### Why Is Tennis Scored So Weirdly? --- ## Transcript I'm Simon Schuster. I've been covering Ukraine and Russia for about 15 years roughly 10 of those years for Time Magazine. Then that's just been my focus pretty much my entire career. I'm Carl Vick editor-at-large at time, which I joined in 2010 in order to run the Jerusalem Bureau for time. So I was there for four years and been covering the Middle East. I think the similarities in the two Wars are all fairly superficial. I think what they what they have in common is that the imagery that people see on their screens observing these wars storical e in in terms of the the the nature of the conflict the goals of the belligerent side. I don't see what the day have much in common. What they have in common is u.s. Involvement President Biden being involved in wanting to arm one side and both In both conflicts and he's Oval Office Speech. I think he linked them by saying each was an attack on an energy in a democracy, some food represent different dress, but they share this in common. They both want to completely annihilate in neighboring democracy completely annihilated. The US has in the last few Generations become basically the primary Allied and sponsor of of Israel. It's got a thing at the state department level and every Administration maintain something guaranteeing. Military superiority for the Israeli military called qualitative. Military Edge, I think do we get things that are best for the first country that gets gets are our best weapons are most advanced Fighters intelligence cooperation is almost hand-in-glove Ukraine would like to be in a similar position to be the United States. I mean already I think the United States level of support its role in supporting Ukraine is decisive one line the stands out and in my most recent interview with President Glen's Keys is he was describing of a meeting with US senators where they asked him if we don't give you the aid we don't give you the money what happens and he said what happens is we will lose that gives you an idea of how decisive the role of a u.s. Support the president himself said this A lot of people in presidential a circle and in the military leadership in Ukraine, who and this is before the October 7th terrorist attacks and in the beginning of this this late at 4. They aspire to become a partner to the United States into the Europeans like Israel. They talked often about the Israeli model of development. But as they say the country is really shaking his really. It feels like there was a pole then by Tel Aviv University in the last weeks of October in the ass people. Do you think the amount that the level of force that Israeli military using in Gaza is too little the right amount to much. No, 58% of Jewish Israelis said they're not using enough for some Gaza. So the whole world is watching this war through the you know footage of of what's happening and Israelis are one day. They really believe that they have to re-establish the their defense Doctrine which is deterrence which is if you hit as well, you'll be hit so hard you won't it won't occur to you to hit us again or anyone else, but they also do not see this conflict through the the way the rest of the world sees that they be the effect of the October 7th Massacre was so profound to a Jewish population that has the most the strongest military in the region and one of the strongest in the world. But they don't see themselves that way they see themselves as as vulnerable choose who's been 2,000 years without a home being chased from country to Country Inn victims of programs in things like the Holocaust so all of that uncertainty and security got reawakened and made fresh by the Hamas attack in the atrocities that I must carry out. And that I talk to his therapist who we're dealing with survivors and and these are left wing. Empathetic people who generally would like she's like I try to always try to save some thoughts for the Palestinians and what they're experiencing and and and they just don't have it this time and it's not that they're angry and it's revenged. They're just their capacity for empathy is totally exhausted totally full there at that. They cannot lift their gaze from what's happened in their country to what's going on in and Gaza. But about 20 months into the full-scale invasion when the entire country is effectively a war zone susceptible to Russian missile strikes and mass attacks. No one felt safe in those 20 months and I think one thing that stood out to me this time was people felt tired. It's a long time to be at War and I should say, you know, the desire the resilience to to achieve Victory is still overwhelming. This is clear in opinion polls where the vast majority of ukrainians say, they will not countenance. Any peace negotiations with Russia that even consider territorial concessions giving away land to the Russians in exchange for peace. Ukrainians are not ready to to even consider that according to the opinion polls and end according to my conversations to but still the fatigue shows. The economy is is in terrible shape as you can imagine a country where you know, there are no civilian flights. The only way to travel around the country is b r a m by car because the only that they are space is full of fighter jets missiles and and anti-aircraft fire people wanted wanted Victory. They were determined to kind of keep fighting and making sacrifices for the sake of Victory. But the fatigue was just it was their people had to start at some point thinking about themselves their families their savings. They're they're kind of material well-being the future, you know, I think a lot of people who left had to make a decision left the beginning of the invasion had to make a decision. Am I going to come back and try to help my country or will I stay abroad and try to try to build a future for myself. They also depend on on the news on president zelensky. Barry White that if there isn't some success that he the authorities the military can point to the mood within Society slowly kind of goes toward fatigue depression sadness. Where is if he can demonstrate some victory even if it's not a strategic breakthrough but some victory on the battlefield that he can point to and say look for winning. We're kicking their butts were kicking them out that helps that helps lift up the spirits of society that that's been consistent throughout the invasion. It just feels like it's been a long time since I'm a major victory has his raise the spirits of the Ukrainian people and Ukrainian leadership. ```json {"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"VideoObject","name":"The Intricacies of U.S. Involvement for Israel and Ukraine","description":"TIME Senior Correspondent Simon Shuster and Editor-At-Large Karl Vick explain the intricacies within the two biggest geopolitical conflicts in 2023 and how the U.S. plays a role in the future of these wars.","thumbnailUrl":"https://cdn.jwplayer.com/v2/media/4GppEBmH/poster.jpg?width=720","uploadDate":"2023-11-14T21:48:15.000Z","contentUrl":"https://cdn.jwplayer.com/manifests/4GppEBmH.m3u8","embedUrl":"https://time.com/video/4GppEBmH/","duration":"PT8M48S","potentialAction":{"@type":"SeekToAction","target":"https://time.com/video/4GppEBmH/?jw_start={seek_to_second_number}","startOffset-input":"required name=seek_to_second_number"}} ```