10 Questions: Ma Ying-jeou

Telegenic, articulate and highly educated (he has a doctorate in juridical science from Harvard), Taipei Mayor and Kuomintang (KMT) chairman Ma Ying-jeou is the frontrunner to become Taiwan’s President in the next election in 2008. Ma, who turns 56 this week, spoke with Time’s Zoher Abdoolcarim and Natalie Tso about the scandals swirling around President Chen Shui-bian, cross-strait relations with China and his vision for Taiwan.

President Chen’s relatives and aides are accused of financial irregularities, but he’s not. Why do you want him to step down?
We don’t feel pride in the President anymore. When he loses the confidence and respect of the people, there is no way for him to lead the country.

Doesn’t the political fighting damage Taiwan’s image?
No. We’re trying really to clean up the government.

What about tackling corruption in the KMT?
We have set up a “clean government” commission to monitor our officials. When I was justice minister more than 12 years ago, I cracked down on corruption and vote-buying. I have a reputation for being clean and impartial, [and] we know that how clean we are determines our future.

Can the KMT regain power in 2008?
If the President stays on, it actually works to our benefit. But it’s not in the interest of his Democratic Progressive Party. If they’re reluctant to say goodbye to him, they’ll pay a big price.

Under Chen, cross-strait relations have been frozen. How would you improve ties with Beijing?
We would not pursue de jure independence … We would resume negotiations on the basis of the 1992 consensus [forged during talks in Hong Kong]in short, “one China, different interpretations.” We would facilitate economic exchanges leading eventually to a common market. We would facilitate cultural and educational exchanges, like letting mainland students attend universities in Taiwan, because we have a surplus capacity and they are very short of that … If the two sides get together, the chance of war will be minimized.

What if Beijing insists on “one China”?
It doesn’t matter. We don’t have to recognize each other; all we have to do is not challenge and not deny the existence of the other side.

Beijing has hundreds of missiles pointed at Taiwan. Do you trust China’s leaders?
No. If they don’t do something about the missiles, we won’t negotiate. [But] during the two trips [former KMT chairman] Lien Chan made to China, what was missing was actually more important than what was present: “one country, two systems” and “unification of the motherland” were never mentioned by any Chinese official. Many in Taiwan believe that Hu Jintao is much more sophisticated than his predecessors in understanding Taiwan. He represents a different generation of leaders, more pragmatic, less ideological.

How would you boost Taiwan’s economy?
We need direct trade, transport and postal services with China. Without direct flights, it takes us six to seven hours to fly from Taipei to Shanghai, so we’ve effectively moved Taipei to where Jakarta is. Can you think of anything more stupid than that? We’re very strong in R&D, design, incubation and marketing, but it’s too expensive to manufacture in Taiwan anymore, so there should be a division of labor between Taiwan and the mainland.

Do you think you will see a democratic China in your lifetime?
With Taiwan, it took about 40 years to go from an authoritarian to a democratic society. With the mainland, it should take longer. But the Internet makes things very different. After our [local] elections last December, I went on China’s People’s Net, which is owned by the People’s Daily. People were [posting messages like]: “Why can’t we vote just like people in Taiwan? Are we second-class citizens?” The existence of Taiwan poses a powerful comparison to the mainland.

How do you see yourself?
When I went to the U.S. in March, the Americans thought I may be too close to the mainland. But I am one of the few politicians in Taiwan who attends the Tiananmen memorial service every year. I am the only politician to go to a Falun Gong gathering. I was the first politician in Taiwan to criticize China’s antisecession law, not because I support Taiwan independence, but because [the law] is unnecessary and unwise. I am Taiwanese as well as Chinese.