--- title: Why Vivek Ramaswamy Is Donald Trump’s Most Obvious Heir description: A policy debate with a TIME columnist demonstrated why Ramaswamy is standing out in a crowded GOP field, and doing best with Trump's base canonical: https://time.com/6316072/vivek-ramaswamy-donald-trump-maga-heir/ author: Philip Elliott article:opinion: false article:content_tier: free article:published_time: 2023-09-20T16:59:43.000Z article:modified_time: 2026-10-19T07:26:47.599Z article:section: Politics og:title: Why Ramaswamy Is Trump’s Most Obvious Heir og:description: A policy debate with a TIME columnist demonstrated why Ramaswamy is standing out in a crowded GOP field, and doing best with Trump's base og:url: https://time.com/6316072/vivek-ramaswamy-donald-trump-maga-heir/ og:site_name: TIME og:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/blt2da960c734f55c4d/698a4096b21a9c447350799e/GettyImages-1678595589.jpg?branch=production&width=1024&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 og:image:width: 1024 og:image:height: 576 og:image:alt: Republican Presidential Candidate Vivek Ramaswamy Delivers Major Domestic Policy Speech At The America First Policy Institute In D.C. og:type: article twitter:card: summary_large_image twitter:title: Why Ramaswamy Is Trump’s Most Obvious Heir twitter:description: A policy debate with a TIME columnist demonstrated why Ramaswamy is standing out in a crowded GOP field, and doing best with Trump's base twitter:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/blt2da960c734f55c4d/698a4096b21a9c447350799e/GettyImages-1678595589.jpg?branch=production&width=1024&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 ---  # Why Vivek Ramaswamy Is Donald Trump’s Most Obvious Heir > Sponsored content. 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It explains the politics, personalities and power dynamics behind the headlines, twice a week. #### Where can I get analysis of Washington politics by email? D.C. Brief is TIME's free Washington politics newsletter, available at time.com/newsletters. It is written by a TIME senior correspondent who covers the capital full time. #### Who writes TIME's D.C. Brief? Philip Elliott, a senior correspondent at TIME, writes D.C. Brief. #### Is D.C. Brief free? Yes. D.C. Brief is free at time.com/newsletters. ### Sources * TIME Newsletters: [time.com/newsletters](/c/time-nl-dcbrief-2026q3/newsletters?i=0af28eb7-617b-454c-88dd-26f95a717f18&cr=time-nl-dcbrief-2026q3-v1) ## Video: Vivek Ramaswamy Is Defending Trump More Forcefully Than Other 2024 Contenders [Watch (HLS stream): Vivek Ramaswamy Is Defending Trump More Forcefully Than Other 2024 Contenders](https://cdn.jwplayer.com/manifests/vL2QCvOX.m3u8) (2:20)  _Published 2023-03-22. Vivek Ramaswamy, the “anti-woke” entrepreneur, is unabashedly defending Donald Trump against expected criminal charges, a defense that is also serving as his introduction to a party that still loves Trump while remaining not entirely sold that a third nomination for someone seemingly hours away from a perp walk is prudent. The tactic may demand a re-evaluation of the state of the 2024 primary field._  by [Philip Elliott](https://time.com/author/philip-elliott/)  ## Philip Elliott Senior Correspondent Sep 20, 2023 4:59 PM UTC Vivek Ramaswamy, the “anti-woke” entrepreneur, is unabashedly defending Donald Trump against expected criminal charges, a defense that is also serving as his introduction to a party that still loves Trump while remaining not entirely sold that a third nomination for someone seemingly hours away from a perp walk is prudent. The tactic may demand a re-evaluation of the state of the 2024 primary field.  by [Philip Elliott](https://time.com/author/philip-elliott/)  ## Philip Elliott Senior Correspondent Sep 20, 2023 4:59 PM UTC _This article is part of The D.C. Brief, TIME’s politics newsletter. Sign up_ [_here_](https://cloud.newsletters.time.com/signup?nln=dc-brief&source=dc%5Fonsite) _to get stories like this sent to your inbox._ Vivek Ramaswamy sat sipping his decaffeinated green tea in the center of a Capitol Hill hotel’s restaurant. He was extolling the awesome powers of the federal executive, which he insists would allow a President Ramaswamy to [shed](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/13/us/politics/vivek-ramaswamy-dismantle-government.html) 75% of the federal workforce and reorganize the bureaucracy in ways that would make the most senior McKinsey bros giddy. It was obvious this wasn’t the first time he was running this deck, even if no laptops, tablets, or projectors were in sight. But, when I pushed back on his argument, making the case that if presidents are empowered to unilaterally slash and burn entire agencies, then they also can dramatically expand government just as easily, Ramaswamy didn’t respond like the typical presidential candidates. Instead of simply repeating his own point or waiving away mine, the 38-year-old paused and gave the matter careful consideration. “If you're coming in from that angle,” he told me, “I would actually answer the question a little bit differently.” Which is what he did, leaning back a little before explaining why he didn’t think the executive power he hopes to wield “goes in both directions.” “It's different if you're actually shutting down agencies that Congress never authorized,” he continued. “It's a one-way ratchet.” Nuanced. Careful. Reasonable. It also may be complete hogwash that wouldn’t pass muster with even the current Supreme Court. Nonetheless, the conversation cut directly against [the image of Ramaswamy](https://time.com/6305440/vivek-ramaswamy-interview-republican-primary/) to this point. On the trail, in ubiquitous media appearances, and on the first debate stage, Ramaswamy often comes off as a brash bully, a privileged prig with a chip on his shoulder and “wokeness” in his sniper’s scope, a candidate who seethes with contempt for expertise or experience. His detractors have assessed that Ramaswamy will say and do whatever is needed to please the audience before him. But that wasn’t the guy sitting across from me, by now picking at a plate of spaghetti and snacking on deviled eggs. Here, it was a Socratic seminar on the promise and limits of government, the kind of dialogue that doesn’t necessarily do well on a soapbox at the Iowa State Fair. Ramaswamy’s ability to transition so seamlessly between those two aspects of his personality explains, at least in part, why he may be the most interesting and unknowable factor in the unfolding fight for the future of the GOP. Republicans in 2016 nominated a candidate who also seemed to lack any ideological core but knew how to put on a show, a walking contradiction of a man who could win over the Christian Right and white women voters, despite being a thrice-married philanderer who bragged about sexually assaulting women. Why wouldn’t the modern GOP at least consider someone who openly advertises the same intellectual flexibility, readiness to fight, and disregard for consistency? Especially now that their first foray into nominated nihilism finds himself indicted in four separate criminal cases? Ramaswamy, for his part, is careful here. Publicly, he is perhaps DonaldTrump’s most loyal—if lonely—defender. From the start of his nascent run, he was careful to stand next to Trump and Trumpism, recognizing its potency. When the FBI raided Trump’s Florida club, Ramaswamy had Trump’s back. When the charges started to come, Ramaswamy screamed about a weaponized Department of Justice and sounded every bit like a mob boss hinting that it sure would be unfortunate if loyalty mattered for nothing. Heck, Ramaswamy even chose the office of [Trump’s unofficial braintrust](https://time.com/6313369/vivek-ramaswamys-speech-trump-think-tank/) last week to make a major policy speech about the _hows_ of a Ramaswamy agenda. And there was a central contradiction of Ramaswamy. While he professes contempt for the power centers of D.C., he really wants them to at least acknowledge him, even if that takes plenty of hyperbole delivered through a smirk. Ramaswamy is due to deliver his next big speech on Thursday in Ohio. The topic: how the U.S.can win its technology rivalry with China. A week later will come the second GOP debate, where he may once again find himself ganged up on by his rivals, who don’t even try to hide how little they think of him. Still, Ramaswamy holds a talent here. Whether or not Trump sees the 2024 race through, Ramaswamy may well be his heir apparent. Unless he wants to cash in and disappear, he isn’t going anywhere any time soon. _Make sense of what matters in Washington._ [_Sign up for the D.C. Brief newsletter_](https://cloud.newsletters.time.com/signup?nln=dc-brief&source=dc%5Fonsite)_._ ## Transcript [00:00] I'll tell you this when we rallied behind the cry to make America [00:05] great again, we did not just hunger for a single man, [00:09] we hungered for the Unapologetic pursuit of Excellence. [00:13] That is what it means to be an American. [00:16] Can you going to hear tomorrow night from my good friend? [00:20] Donald Trump a man who I took inspiration from to do what I am [00:24] doing. Now if he hadn't done what he did in 2015 and 2016 as [00:29] an outsider to came and shake up the system, [00:31] I wouldn't have even thought about doing what I'm doing today [00:34] and running for president. [00:36] That's just a fact, okay. [00:40] It's possible. Is this goes and I will get a little bit of name [00:44] calling and you know what that's part of. [00:47] What do you say? [00:48] Locker room, talk, little bit of trash talk on the court. [00:50] Got to have some fun and handle it, [00:52] but I think if you can handle a little bit of name-calling [00:54] in this or have some fun, you probably shouldn't be the person [00:57] sitting across the table represent in this country in front of [01:00] Xi Jinping either. [01:01] But I will tell you something about my friend. [01:04] He has misunderstood across this country. [01:06] I know him. [01:08] He cares. Deeply about National Unity. [01:12] I know you care. [01:14] Deeply about National Unity. [01:16] I'm running for president because I care deeply about National [01:20] Unity. But here's the question. [01:22] This is the question, for the next year-and-a-half [01:25] in the conservative movement in the Republican party, [01:28] in America [01:31] Do we want a national divorce or do we want a national Revival? [01:38] It's not going to happen automatically, whatever it is it is going [01:42] to be what we choose it to be a lot of what I'm pursuing [01:46] right sounds extreme and yet their extreme ideas that most Americans [01:51] share a commitment to that's my whole season for my candidacy. [01:54] We deliver National unit I think I'm the best position candidates [01:58] to deliver National unity and either political party because [02:02] I will embrace unapologetically the extremism of the ideas [02:06] that America was down. [02:08] And it turns out it was her idea is that most Americans [02:11] still share today, deep in their phone and I'm running for president [02:15] to revive them, and I think we will and I, [02:18] I think we will in a landslide. ```json [{"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","@id":"https://time.com/6316072/vivek-ramaswamy-donald-trump-maga-heir/","mainEntityOfPage":{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https://time.com/6316072/vivek-ramaswamy-donald-trump-maga-heir/"},"headline":"Why Vivek Ramaswamy Is Donald Trump’s Most Obvious Heir","datePublished":"2023-09-20T16:59:43.000Z","dateModified":"2026-10-19T07:26:47.599Z","description":"A policy debate with a TIME columnist demonstrated why Ramaswamy is standing out in a crowded GOP field","url":"https://time.com/6316072/vivek-ramaswamy-donald-trump-maga-heir/","keywords":["The D.C. 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