--- title: Wordle Creator Josh Wardle Talks NYT Sale, Game's Success description: The Wordle creator Josh Wardle talks about why he created the game, the internet's ethos, and why he sold to the New York Times canonical: https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/ author: Karl Vick article:opinion: false article:content_tier: free article:published_time: 2022-02-01T19:50:37.000Z article:modified_time: 2026-08-04T07:45:46.128Z article:section: Entertainment og:title: How Wordle's Creator Feels About Selling His Viral Game og:description: The Wordle creator Josh Wardle talks about why he created the game, the internet's ethos, and why he sold to the New York Times og:url: https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/ og:site_name: TIME og:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/bltbec288c60bcef4fb/698a21ff16d88463d2c3a499/Wordle.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 og:image:width: 2400 og:image:height: 1350 og:image:alt: Wordle og:type: article twitter:card: summary_large_image twitter:title: How Wordle's Creator Feels About Selling His Viral Game twitter:description: The Wordle creator Josh Wardle talks about why he created the game, the internet's ethos, and why he sold to the New York Times twitter:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/bltbec288c60bcef4fb/698a21ff16d88463d2c3a499/Wordle.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 ---  # How Wordle's Creator Feels About Selling His Viral Game > Sponsored content. 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Moderated by Ian Orefice (President & COO, TIME & TIME Studios)._  by [Karl Vick](https://time.com/author/karl-vick/)  ## Karl Vick Editor at Large Feb 1, 2022 7:50 PM UTC  Josh Wardle of Wordle. Josh Wardle of Wordle. Illustration by TIME  by [Karl Vick](https://time.com/author/karl-vick/)  ## Karl Vick Editor at Large Feb 1, 2022 7:50 PM UTC A couple of hours after the New York _Ti_ _mes_ [announced](https://time.com/6143832/new-york-times-buys-wordle/) on Monday that it had acquired the online word [game](https://www.powerlanguage.co.uk/wordle/) known as Wordle, its inventor was still looking for the right word—this time, for his emotions. “My biggest sense, actually, right now, isn’t joy. It’s relief,” Josh Wardle, who was paid “in the low seven figures” for the daily puzzle, told me by phone. It was our second conversation in as many days. In the front seat of a running car the the day before (we were to talk in a park, but it was 25° F) Wardle had betrayed no hint of any impending windfall. In fact, much of the conversation was about how his invention—a simple game that gives a player six chances to guess a five-letter word—demonstrated that the internet could be about something other than money. “I made something,” he explained, “that I would like to exist on the internet.” Other people liked it too. One way to measure the popularity of [Wordle](https://www.powerlanguage.co.uk/wordle/) is the number of people playing it each day. On Nov 1, there were 90\. By the end of December, there were 300,000\. During the month of January, the number swelled beyond 10 million, that kind of acceleration that creates its own weather. The opening sketch of the Jan. 22 _Saturday Night Live_ [featured](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L069cmM8wTA) an impersonation of former President Donald Trump playing Wordle. But when we met, Wardle had not wanted his photo taken, and was clearly worn down by the attention tsunami that a few days earlier had swept across the Great Plains to engulf a Canadian industrial equipment salesman with the same name: “Regina man mistaken for inventor of Wordle fielding flood of emails, CNN interview request” was the headline on a CBC story. “I think if I was actually the creator,” the Canadian Josh Wardle [observed ](https://globalnews.ca/news/8543805/regina-josh-wardle-mistaken-wordle-fame/)to a reporter, “I’d be quite exhausted.” He was. “My inbox is destroyed,” Wardle said slowly, staring through the windshield. He grew up on an organic livestock farm in southern Wales, and came to the States for an MFA in digital art at the [University of Oregon](https://www.wweek.com/news/2022/01/24/uo-alum-josh-wardle-created-the-online-puzzle-game-wordle-that-has-become-a-cultural-phenomenon/), then found work in Silicon Valley. While at Reddit, he created a couple of projects that, by inviting people to take part in something entirely new, doubled as case studies in a question that lately pre-occupies much of the world: How does the design of a site steer the behavior of the people coming to it? Wordle provides one answer. It was fashioned for an audience of one: his partner, Palak Shah, because she likes word games. It went out into the larger world almost as a whim, without any of the things that could generate money—like ads, or “push” notifications to encourage you to hurry back or linger. You can play only once a day, and that play benefits only you, or whoever you want to talk about it with. Far from producing income, the game (at least until Jan. 31) was actually costing Wardle money, the roughly $100 a month required to keep it online. He seemed fine with that. And it seemed the most interesting aspect of what he was doing. “That was never the goal, really, to make money,” he said in the car. “The goal was to make a game that my partner would enjoy playing. What’s interesting is, people ask me all the time about the monetization stuff. Like, ‘You could put ads on it, You could do premium.’ And I don’t know, maybe I’m an idiot. None of that really appeals to me. I think because I started with the intention of not doing it, it’s been easy to say no. If I’d been trying to make a viral game I think it would be very different.” Those versions are all over the web, now[ thick](https://www.reddit.com/r/wordle/comments/rxod0p/any%5Fgood%5Fknockoffs/) with knock-offs. Wordle has existed in a different space, one generated by the delight of the people playing it. The source of that delight was, like the target word, not obvious but within reach. There had been other games based on five letters. Wordle’s appeal lay in a design that reflected the simplicity, or maybe purity of its intention. --- ### More from TIME --- For a game played by one person, it has encouraged a fair amount of community, which is the part Wardle says has moved him. (“It has been incredible to watch a game bring so much joy to so many,” he said in a statement [posted](https://twitter.com/powerlanguish/status/1488263944309731329/photo/1) on Twitter after the sale.) For some reason, it first caught on in New Zealand, a small country where Twitter is a more intimate thing. It was a player there who came up with a way of sharing how well you did on a puzzle without revealing the target word. Wardle thanked her, turned it into a bit of code, and passed it on. The game didn’t even have an app. When people searched for Wordle where apps are sold, they found one created by someone else, Steve Cravotta, who had used the name for a different game. When Cravaotta noticed the spike in purchases, rather than pocketing the money, he offered it to Wardle, who didn’t feel right about taking it either. Together, they decided it should go to [Boost! West Oakland,](http://boostoakland.org/index.html) a tutoring nonprofit where Shah had volunteered. “I built a prototype of Wordle in, like, 2013,” Wardle says. “There were a couple of things wrong with it. You loaded up the game, and it picked a random word from the 13,000 that are five letters long. And it turns out in the English language, there are a lot of really, really out there words. And so that game was different. Like, brute force, you were trying a lot of guesses that weren’t words, which didn’t feel good to me.” Shah actually winnowed he 13,000 down to the fraction regarded as commonly used. And in January 2021, during the long COVID-19 winter, Wardle revisited the project. Shah had been playing a lot of Spelling Bee, the _New York Times_ word game. As a couple, they moved on to the Times crossword, and cryptic crosswords, where the clues are also puzzles. “So we were just playing a lot of word games,” he says. And it was like, Can I make a word game that she would enjoy that we would enjoy playing together?” For a few months, they kept it to themselves and their families, then opened it to the public at powerlanguage.co.uk, a domain with an auspicious air. “It’s [my alias](https://powerlanguage.co.uk/) that I use online,” Wardle explains. “It comes from me and my friend fooling around in his backyard. We were young and dumb and the neighbor came over and shouted at us. What I thought he said was, “Don’t use that power language.” I think it was because we were swearing. Turns out in retrospect, I’m pretty sure he was saying “foul language.” I misheard it as “power language,” but I was so captivated by the idea that swearing would be called power language—the idea that it had this power—that I got caught up in it in a way that you do when you’re a teenager, these dumb things. So I bought a domain name. And, hey, if you’re going to release a game that goes viral, don’t put it on a website called powerlanguage dot co dot U.K. forward slash Wordle. I’ll tell you that for free. Everyone has to Google ‘wordle’ every day because no one can remember what the domain is.” His Twitter handle, on the other hand, is @powerlanguish. “That’s just, ‘powerlanguage’ was taken,” he says. “And I like words. And I thought, like power language, it kind of seems enigmatic and compelling, again, in a way that I probably wouldn’t choose now. But here we are.” And where is that? At the conclusion of an intriguing experiment. Wardle has escaped a juggernaut by surrendering his invention to the commercial side of the web. He speaks respectfully of the _Times_‘ approach to puzzles (its [news release](https://www.nytco.com/press/wordle-new-york-times-games/) noted that it brought the world the Times crossword in 1942), and said that the company would keep Wordle in front of its paywall. The _Times_, however, added the word “initially” to that promise, because even though in SEC filings the company’s [stated mission](https://time.com/5696968/a-g-sulzberger-new-york-times/) is to operate “as an independent newspaper, entirely fearless, free of ulterior influence and unselfishly devoted to the public welfare,” it needs money to do that. Its Games [subscription](https://www.nytimes.com/subscription/games) has 1 million digital subscribers, paying $5 a month, or $40 a year. This frees Wardle to concentrate on his day job as a software engineer—and return to the other internet, the edges of which glimmers from his [home page](https://powerlanguage.co.uk/) and Twitter [feed](https://twitter.com/powerlanguish). It seems lighter and more airy than the one where we spend so much of our lives. Cartoon people[ frolic](https://playkids.ch/process/), and artists invent games for their sweethearts. At times, however, one web touches the other. You can witness this phenomenon in the YouTube [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXzfvYoFQFo&t=1326s) on Wardle’s site, which shows a talk he gave about some of his projects at Reddit. The most fascinating was called simply [Place](https://www.newsweek.com/reddit-place-internet-experiment-579049). It was a blank canvas visitors were invited to fill, one pixel of color at a time. But people had to take turns. If you laid down a tile, you had to wait five minutes before you could lay down another one. The first image that took shape looked like a drawing from a bathroom wall. It was a phallus. Wardle began to despair. “One of the issues we face is around collaboration,” he says in the YouTube after-action report. “A small group of toxic people can ruin the experience for the many.” Then he realized that the people arriving at Place were being shown only what had already been started. He tweaked the code to bring newcomers to a stretch of virgin canvas, where they could start fresh. And they did. Three days later, after a million people had placed 16 million tiles, Place ended up as a striking mosaic. Staring out the windshield, Wardle explains: “So previously, when everyone was standing in the center of the canvas, they’d see this big phallic thing emerging, and they would contribute to it. When we started them in a blank area of the canvas, I think it maybe challenged them to think about what they would like to create, right, it wasn’t just ‘add to the first thing that was there.’ “And I’m, like, wary of trying to extrapolate that out to make a statement about what tech companies should or shouldn’t be doing, right? It was an art project on the internet. But I think for me personally, it was like really useful to think about what responsibility you have when you create a space for people interact. You actually make a ton of decisions that impact the way that they interact with one another. And humans interacting is very, very complicated. Humans are very, very complicated.” ## Transcript What is going on Sundance 2020 to? My name is Ian orifice on the president and CEO overtime. And time Studios could not be more excited to be here with you. All unfortunately is not in person, but still incredibly lucky and fortunate to be here with everyone virtually we are here to talk about and I'm biased. Let's just get that out of the way. I'm biased what time Studios is involved with the project. I think it's the best project that's come out in a very long time. And more importantly, these two directors and another very special guests that we're going to talk through genius today. Could not be more excited. I want to introduce everyone that we have here. Let's start with the two directors that are bringing this unbelievable epic project out in the world. Cody. And Chica. What's going on. Thank you for being here. Thank you. Thank you. Like you said and we wish we was in person, but everybody do everything happen for a reason. So we heading out and I'm happy for sure. And also want to introduce jiv who has his own accolades outside of the outside of this project that are Wildly impressive but was instrumental for genius. My writing perspectives. What's going on? Thanks for being there. But I have me great to be here with everyone. I hope you watch Andrew able to experience the first film of Genius, a Kanye West Trilogy. And the structure of this project is three different feature films and I hope everyone got a chance to see it. And if not, you will see it soon in theaters, on February 10th, and you'll see it on Netflix on February 16th, who didn't seek a? This is a project that is 21 years in the making. I just want to start here. What is this moment? Feel like for you guys, you started this journey more than two decades ago and your film just premiered last night. Your first film in Sundance. What's going on your mind right now? I'm actually an incredibly feel it feel great. You know, this is, this is, you know, I give it all up to God, you know, I mean, this is definitely God. That's why I will work, you know, to have the vision even defend kayak and God giving me that vision. And you know, for me to even micci K & J. I V and, you know, Mighty Men and the end, of course you are in, you know, the saying that going into town I'm in making this project have any more dope. I'm energized say that the type of impact. Phil make and and I guess, you know, I can't wait to see how they respond. That I think that were. In fact, it is super important for Time and Time Studios. It is our number one value. How do we make impact in the world? How do we produce and be fortunate enough to work on projects that truly moved the world, right? Our mission is storytelling, that moves the world and I wanted to do my first choice would have been in person, but since we couldn't do that, I wanted to make sure where I was coming from and where time was coming from with the special Quest. So everyone watching right now, you're inside the time and time Studios headquarters in New York, and I wanted to be here cuz this, at least for us is where the journey began. So October, 2019, Cuda, and she guy who I've not met in person before but have been a huge fan of their work through Benji and the kid from Coney Island and other project. I heard through Rebecca titles, work. The time that they, they had a lot of footage about Kanye and they've been doing this project for a long time and we are interested. So cuti and she can't come into our office. Exactly what I Standing right now and he's got a duffel bag with him and I'm thinking, we probably just came from the gym. He then opened up his duffel bag and pours, out two decades worth of mini DV tapes and says, this is what I've been doing for the past two decades. I've been capturing through his lens, the Journey of Kanye, the Journey of Hip Hop from Chicago to New York and really pretty and Chica is journey to we as I hope you saw it last night fell in love with the project in the mission and really fell in love with codeine GK and I I'd like to go back way further October 2019, coup d'etat Custer's. The beginning of What made you have that belief in that Faith to start filming 21 years ago with us. I would like, you know, I was doing stand-up comedy in Chicago on Bernie. Mac was my mentor. The first person to bring me on stage. And, and then from that this guy named Danny sword, I asked me to Kostas Public Access show called Channel Zero. So I started doing that. And I just started falling in love with the reaction that we were given. We, we are at on public access will go to barber shops and put the tape and people go crazy. And next thing. I know Danny wouldn't do, you know, want to go. He he didn't fell in love more with with cutting hair. So I like that. Teach me how to use your camera. So when he told me when he showed me how to use it. I will go out and then I've noticed, Kanye remember he was performing with his group to go get us and when I seen him cuz he used to come in the barbershop where we were at near play beats and I might do this. Talented man. I seen him on stage. I would like this is the truth and then next thing I know we with some local rappers and we wanted to Kanye to go to Kanye crib and I'm like, seeing how charismatic you was hail of the camera and I and it was the documentary hoop dreams. That I said. I'm going to do the hoop dreams and I know everybody who seen the film know this part of the story, you know, so I did a hoop dreams. Okay? Yeah, but I just knew it since I seen Grammys, I seen him. I seen them human. I thought everybody seen that but come and find out as I was document. Now, I'm going to take a chance and move to New York, dropped everything. And, and people didn't, they didn't know, it wasn't, you know, he wasn't a clear shot for everybody in the end, but I'm happy I stuck with with document, which led me to meet chike my partner. And, and that's what you told me and she gave him moving ever since 2. Being one of the writers on on the film's, you you played a role both on camera in the film it and really experienced this. What are you hope that this film means the audience and beans the world. And what's your, what's your reaction to having this all come out right now? Yeah, 12 first. I think the timing is perfect. And one of the things, one of the main things that that we talked about people pulling of drawn from this film is realizing that they will all the genius are, you know, and this is all ordained. This is all like one at one of my favorite clothes is the cooties is no God, direct my videos and we've seen that the rear, you know, I go back, you know, what? Cody back to you know, the mid-90s in Chicago, so we were able to solve each other's rise. We saw each other, you know, climb and and, and chasing the Chasing the Dream like to go to Comedy Club to do poetry and and one of the things to do as far as as far as the film as far as the time, there was the Chicago Renaissance happening and there were a lot of a lot of dreamers that with that. We're going after their after that after that passions. And when it come, The film. What we want people to see is that those dreams can come true. When you exercise your gifts and you live in your purpose, you can you do bring your boyfriend. That's, that's really the main thing for sure. What about for you? You've been directing the cootie for her for a long time. Now you guys are done incredible work. When you think about what this film and what genius is going to mean to the world. What's your hope and how I know how it received and what the meaning of this film is a person and meaning is really to give people the opportunity to believe in themselves that they can actually unlock the genius and really follow their true passions and feel confident enough to do that. And hopefully I films, giving them sort of a blueprint on what first steps and especially this film that everybody just on what steps to take. You know, it's starting to unlocking and have a vision cuz You can see if you trying to go and make it a lot easier easier to get there and have faith to help you out this man to any fear. Art of wood. So inspiring for me. And again, I just want to reiterate, it is impossible for me to be unbiased in this conversation, given for these two and also times role in producing the project. But one of the things that that really struck me was how inspirational the film is, and it's on two different levels. One is on cootie and TK having this dream and have in the past. And I think a lot of people have an idea to do something great, but aren't necessarily ready to commit this long of time this much devotion. And that's me as it as a producer in just a human is incredibly inspiring. And I think that also relates to what you see through Kanye specifically in this first film. And for those that saw that last night or for those that will see it. It is some of the most special raw footage of someone trying to defy how the world perceives him to accomplish what he believes, and what he knows is his future. It included. If you don't mind, just take us through what it was like to be there. As Kanye now. Yeah, he was walking around Rockefeller when no one would give him the time was in the streets of New York. Trying to prove that he was what he believed. What was that like to witness? I mean if it was as far as you know, is Brian for me as well and to see that that drive in that belief that he had in himself. I know that it See, the one thing about Kanye is that, you know, in the picnic, I ain't everybody know now is that I became a blood is, do you know I'm saying? He became a brother to me doing this whole experience of film and you know, we'd be building and you know, it was more than just film and you know, I didn't it felt like tell you the truth. I don't even and I can't believe it took it. I don't care. I had a crazy work ethic and then watch this field was like, oh I had a crazy work out there too. But it seemed like we were just having a ball. We was just kick it. I was happy to be in Def Jam. I'm like, yeah, I'm just excited and we went on the stage with Jay-Z. I'm just like a win Chicago motor stage, but it was great. It was amazing. Cuz you do when they all kind of doubt. I just like cuz you donate day with Daddy want me to feel. They was a whole thing about that. I'm like, you know what? They truly they said I don't even know how I thought. If I do know, I thought it was God. He like yo. And I paid the cat. I just went on the stage like, okay, they got to kick me out cuz I'm going to catch it and I ain't know what was going to happen. I ain't no damn was given the chance to anything, but it was all God, dislike leaving me. And then I just follow that lead and and that happened throughout the whole fam and you will see that in part 2. And part 3 all the way to the to the end. You know, I'm just following and she K&J I go. All of us has just been following this passion in his love, for our our our, our purpose, in life, and in his own, showing these films for sure. If it's cool. I like to geek out on the process for a bit, how many, how many hundreds of hours of footage to do you capture? It was 330, mini DV tapes? 30 mini DV tapes. Again. They were sitting on that table, October 2019 and 100 Sunday at the crazy 7:00, but you got to realize I'm a j. I v e, I've been feeling with the key for the first lady of Wu-Tang Journey. I've been filmed, we found Pitbull John Legend. So you seen a lot of those two, but three hundred and thirty of those with Kanye, you do, and that's also daunting, right? I think you got to show me different angles and what you both crafted with the incredible team that you assemble to is so special. And so personal walk us through that process. How do you even begin? How do you know where to start? When you have so much footage on this type of story? You know, we've been currently over the past two years. Really got into that screen, right? Trying to develop feature films. And so we just did so much reading on just the format of writing a screenplay and sort of the rules and you know, hero's journey and understanding like the ABS and flows of how to put that together. So we were able to transfer a lot of that reading that we have been doing a lot of that. You know, all the rules that I'm tired of the screenplay writing to this film. We wanted to follow a hero's journey. We had to approve a protagonist and Cody and Kanye. So it was like that's where we started. And it made it a lot easier for us because we have so much footage in so many great moments. Once we identified like with the journey was in with the goal. Was it makes it easier for us in a file with footage days in the project and would have to kill a lot of your darling. But if they don't connect to the the goal of what we're trying to get to, you know, makes it easier to okay. What does The Maze if you want to see? This is probably be viral on every put it up on the internet but doesn't fit into a storyline the store with China to tell. So, you know, we stuck to it. The traditional archetypal hero's journey in that, that maybe before us is perfect timing. Cuz like, we've been rehearsing for this moment, when we lived, Angie, we had the great are chilling cylinder and we had a Imani Martin to help us. Make crab that story. And then we moved on to the Muhammad Ali with Jamie Ivey, you know a week then. Javi was the writer on Muhammad Ali and Martin Luther King died with their for bet. And then we went to Stephon Marbury a kid from Coney Island and which we crafted this editing team of Max almond and and Jason Harper that move straight from the kid from Coney Island to this. So now we got this L team jiv came right into write the narration which happened, you know, my changes lie, cuz I wasn't going in there already but it makes sense for me to tell this story. Do do the perspective of my of my lands and and asked, you know, that it was all the magic that happened that God just put put together for us already realized how much time. Etter's would be spending with this constant. Like I said, directors, obviously, we have a vision in a helper spring that patient's life, but they get thrown into this into this process in and made it with this footage just as much as we do when they're in there in it every single day. So, you know, kudos to the editor is Niger, amazing job and I just think that they often too much in the background. Special your socks. Yeah. And by the time we need a summer, can we need a story here? Byron will find it, cuz it was that it's amazing. That was happening. That that's one of the elements of this project that I think it makes it so unique. When you talk about some of the classic documentaries that have happened in the past. A lot of them are reliving the moments, from the pastor, Talking Heads, you sit down the best people in the world and you do the best interviews with the best cameras and you real busy at the past by talking about it, this film, in my opinion plays out a guy happy like an actual scripted movie wood. There are no Talking Heads, you're living in this real Verte footage and Cody with you end up being the narrator of this, journey is the most unique perspective anyone could ever have. Because it's a unique perspective of want those for you. And Jay, when you're really spending time writing this, how do you find your voice to tell that story because you're both an objective filmmaker? And you're also the person that are bringing us all through it. What was that process? Like to find your voice in the, in the actual words? I was saying first God, God wrote it, you know, like you said, it's a documentary weed. You know, we just looking at the footage and the story is telling yourself. So God wrote it and but but as we does I'm telling the story cuz I'm married like okay it is then jiv would just put the the the writing in it. That the words that you know, cuz he's a worse. Nephew know. He's nominated for a grab you right as well. You know that we all was instrumental in creating the storyline, you know, so, you know, but JibJab just put the distinct on it that they kept popping up in this process when the phrases that we'd love to hear, was we Crack the Code? When we heard crack the code that meant we we had a breakthrough. So when, when the eye I did came up and Jason Jason Harper. The other day, I believe was the first one to say, Megan coody. You should be the one to narrate it. So when that code was cracked, that really just open up the flood gate to. Okay. Now we know where we're going and let's just, let's just navigating and and figure out a way to the destination. So it turns out we had a lot of conversations. A lot of conversation. Is it was? It was watching. I was watching footage of reading books. Like like, like like raising Kanye, bye-bye, Mama West. It was a lot of just building in and and trying to find a philosophy, making sure food is voice with authentic, to the story, make making sure that we were being true to coody, story to Kanye story through the history. And and from there. We just do, you know, who we let God, let God cover and goddess, you know, and that's how we got here. And we knew we couldn't said, we couldn't put no words. Play Mouse. We just have to tell the story. How we how we, how we could, you know, and and and I know that people going to see this side of town, yet. He never seen before and and they can fall back in love with him. If they wasn't, you know, he's loved by many but the dogs at they got something something about them. They going to love them even more. I can stand this. There's something that we talked about a lot. Kanye is obviously a very well cover human perhaps. One of the most well-documented history of the world about ya kootie was able to capture something different and his camera. You said this many times at cooties camera really represented empathy and represent a different Viewpoint. What do you mean by that? Even with the personal relationship with Cody. There's a certain thing that brings out and not see him around other people did something. He brings out in you like this. It's almost like a system of accountability. Like you can't not be used from the cootie cuz you'll probably feel awkward and then going back to their relationship. Kanye, tell me when he's around cootie is 100% himself. I mean like and the thing about it is it doesn't change from the beginning to the end. You see the side of Kanye. When Cody has a camera in front of them is a whole nother and I asked, I don't think it's cooties camera. I think it's just cootie included, able to access a side of Kanye. Where does a certain Comfort level? That Caillou has a certain vulnerability and that's what Cody's because his cooties cameras connected security is Lynn gives us insight into their into that phone ability, you know, and I think if you don't have to see, you'll see it in the first film. Just start putting the other two films joke in, get a greater appreciation of it. As you see that the contrast injection position of Cooties can reverse the video camera is off as love, like, what explain likely represents love. So, that's what you everybody, can't help, but feel that love and can't help be authentic to themselves. And, and this is that's when you see the smile. See, Cody smile and you forget the cameras there. The camera is not even there. It's cootie there with all this love and that's what you read to me. Sure, you don't mean he only has the best intention was to cover the best side of you, you know, he's only going to film the best if he sees things that is not going to film it. You still opposite of what were the most people trying to capture on Camp? Sometimes Paparazzi trying to capture or can't but not all but so you don't need maybe with some media is trying to sell through inventory, Roku TV you when he goes, isn't it. As long as you want to bring the best out of you when you're dealing with an artist, he was a genius in his own right, musically, right? And especially if it's tough, people realize how difficult is to have two contracts that music cuz she when you're making original music to go against that. So we made a conscious choice to go with my footage and and chance it is intended to do. I scored because We wanted to kind of go opposite of what the type of music Kanye makes if you want to try to. Play next in space. Can you use the best in that space? You know, so I think a musical Choice, there was a lot of tension in the decisions that we made to work with those two people because of the sound at the able to generate for underscore. I think there's a lot of Ben 10 people are going to when you went, when everyone sees all three films. You realize there was so much intact and every frame and the music to your point. Played, such an important role in a few minutes left. I like to go around the horn here, start with j. Favorite film favorite scene in the film is too. Of course. Now she personally, never let me down is, you know, that was, that was one of those guys send moments to call and to see it's relive. It is just like a wild. Like I've been telling the story of what happened so many years ago to see. It is like wow, like it's incredible. And then I mean every single same with Mama, was because she, she was the epitome of love and she, she was the queen of our village and she wrapped her arms around everyone. We will all have kids. That's why we call them. I'm awake. So all the things along the way, She got. Man, and then I'm still interested for talking about return my vision without the first scene. I have to see them. I have to see the moment been seen with mace. Like when can you put first put the camera just because it's like, You just see the hunger in the passion not in just in Kanye's eyes, but also include his eyes and the fact that it started from there and what have you bought? You going to mean texting store? Because in that moment that minute nobody knows how things are going to play out. So yeah, I think she said that Stacy speaks volumes. My favorite scene of the movie is when we are playing pool at Connie's house. One of the first times I will go over there and just the Simplicity of that scene. In the end. You'll see everybody like Jay, I be coming in and you see 88 keys and consequent, you see so much love and so much passion. And in that room and we just having so much fun to just bring you back to them times it. And I just love that saying, you know, I think that, you know, it's, it's great to have you. No friends. And then in a Chicago just came together in New York like we did and we moved. And Jackie said it that. I reset it in the. You know, just the beginning what you say is that? You mean what you said in the. You make me, make sure you've been through the cracks one. By 10 years later. Here. We are. I think, for me, I would definitely Echo. I'm all done with Jay said about the scenes with with Kanye and and Momma West. Specifically, there's a scene at his house that he grew up in and he's telling her how she did such a good job, raising him and regardless of the fame, and regardless of all of the thought people may have about Kanye. This was a son talking to his mom about the appreciation. He had. What she did for him and the life lesson she gave and I just thought that was so powerful. Thought I'd like to end with this. Last question. It's 2022. Let's fast forward to 2050. There's going to be someone at Sundance revealing, the next epic project and they are going to say like, who do you say now about hoop dreams. I watch that movie genius and inspired me to change my life and do something different and start them on a different path. The cootie. What's your advice to that young kid? Who's going to watch this film and decide to make a change in their life. Simple, one is by Napoleon Hill is if you can conceive and believe you can achieve. No other quiet, nothing else and and have faith in God. That's it. And trust God what I say? Trust God. I might be three things but they they are, an important will take them. She came jiv on it. Thank you guys so much everyone at Sundance, 2020 to hope you all are doing. Well. Thank you for being here, and thank you for watching, genius for everyone that gets to experience this film. Tell your friends about it. Is it on a personal level? I want to thank you guys. It's most special project I've ever had the chance to work on rubber and a Time. The time Studios, the entire team is obviously three people on this call right now, but there is more than 50 and 60 people that work on this project and was a huge team effort to thank you guys for everything and I hope you all enjoy the rest of Sundance 2022. ```json [{"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","@id":"https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/","mainEntityOfPage":{"@type":"WebPage","@id":"https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/"},"headline":"How Wordle's Creator Feels About Selling His Viral Game","datePublished":"2022-02-01T19:50:37.000Z","dateModified":"2026-08-04T07:45:46.128Z","description":"The Wordle creator Josh Wardle talks about why he created the game, the internet's ethos, and why he sold to the New York Times","url":"https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/","keywords":["Technology","Tech"],"thumbnailUrl":"https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/bltbec288c60bcef4fb/698a21ff16d88463d2c3a499/Wordle.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=1200:675&height=675","author":[{"@type":"Person","name":"Karl Vick","jobTitle":"Editor at Large","url":"https://time.com/author/karl-vick/"}],"articleSection":"Entertainment","image":[{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/bltbec288c60bcef4fb/698a21ff16d88463d2c3a499/Wordle.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=1200:675&height=675","width":1200,"height":675,"headline":"Wordle","caption":"Josh Wardle of Wordle.","creditText":"Illustration by TIME","representativeOfPage":true}],"publisher":{"@type":"Organization","name":"Time","url":"https://time.com/","logo":{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://time.com/images/logo.png","width":528,"height":156},"foundingDate":"March 3, 1923","sameAs":["https://www.facebook.com/time","https://www.instagram.com/time/?hl=en","https://twitter.com/time","https://www.pinterest.com/timemagazine"]}},{"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"BreadcrumbList","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"item":{"@id":"/section/entertainment/","name":"Entertainment"}},{"@type":"ListItem","position":2,"item":{"@id":"/tag/technology/","name":"Technology"}},{"@type":"ListItem","position":3,"item":{"@id":"https://time.com/6143715/wordle-sale-josh-wardle-interview/","name":"How Wordle's Creator Feels About Selling His Viral Game"}}]},{"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"VideoObject","name":"The Making of jeen-yuhs: A Kanye Trilogy | TIME Studios","description":"TIME Studios presents a deep-dive into the epic JEEN-YUHS: A KANYE TRILOGY. 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