--- title: Democratic Debate: Clinton, Sanders in High-Stakes Bout description: Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders and Martin O’Malley met on a stage in Charleston for the fourth Democratic debate canonical: https://time.com/4183625/democratic-debate-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/ author: Sam Frizell article:opinion: false article:content_tier: free article:published_time: 2016-01-16T22:37:59.000Z article:modified_time: 2023-12-13T20:20:08.000Z article:section: Politics og:title: Clinton and Sanders Clash at High-Stakes Democratic Debate og:description: Sunday's debate is the last before the Iowa caucuses og:url: https://time.com/4183625/democratic-debate-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/ og:site_name: TIME og:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/blt4d768b757eaed003/69887985a988caa6906b6298/democratic-debate-clinton-sanders-004.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 og:image:width: 2560 og:image:height: 1440 og:image:alt: Democratic U.S. presidential candidate and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and rival candidate U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders speak simultaneously at the Democratic presidential candidates debate in Charleston og:type: article twitter:card: summary_large_image twitter:title: Clinton and Sanders Clash at High-Stakes Democratic Debate twitter:description: Sunday's debate is the last before the Iowa caucuses twitter:image: https://static.time.com/v3/assets/bltea6093859af6183b/blt4d768b757eaed003/69887985a988caa6906b6298/democratic-debate-clinton-sanders-004.jpg?branch=production&width=1200&quality=75&auto=webp&crop=16:9 ---  # Clinton and Sanders Clash at High-Stakes Democratic Debate > Sponsored content. 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Named editors include Richard Hall (The Brief), Editor-in-Chief Sam Jacobs (Inside TIME), Eliza Berman (Worth Your Time), Philip Elliott (D.C. Brief), Justin Worland (Future Proof) and Harry Booth (In the Loop). Health Matters is written by TIME's health desk. #### How do I sign up for a TIME newsletter? Go to time.com/newsletters, choose the newsletters you want and enter your email address. There is no cost and no subscription requirement. ### Sources * TIME Newsletters: [time.com/newsletters](/c/time-nl-network-2026q3/newsletters?i=4dd9c4c1-c623-4655-8428-e5ad5792f60a&cr=time-nl-network-2026q3-v1) ## Video: Democratic Debate: Bernie Sanders on Gun Control [Watch (HLS stream): Democratic Debate: Bernie Sanders on Gun Control](https://cdn.jwplayer.com/manifests/FCxdbcut.m3u8) (2:11)  _Published 2016-01-18. Sanders on Gun Control_ by [Sam Frizell](https://time.com/author/sam-frizell/) ## Sam Frizell Updated: Dec 13, 2023 8:20 PM UTCPublished: Jan 16, 2016 10:37 PM UTC Clinton and Sanders Spar Over Universal Healthcare by [Sam Frizell](https://time.com/author/sam-frizell/) ## Sam Frizell Updated: Dec 13, 2023 8:20 PM UTCPublished: Jan 16, 2016 10:37 PM UTC Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders spent the [fourth Democratic debate](http://time.com/4181009/democratic-debate-watch-live-stream-free-online/) swinging at each other on [gun control](http://time.com/4183978/democratic-debate-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-guns/), [healthcare](http://time.com/4183990/democratic-debate-bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-obamacare/), [Wall Street regulation](http://time.com/4183979/democratic-debate-bernie-sanders-criminal-justice-wall-street/) and their ability to defeat a Republican in a general election, rehashing disputes that have flared up in recent weeks. With the first contests of the Democratic primary drawing near and the race tightening, the battle lines were firmly drawn as [Clinton](http://time.com/4177893/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-gun-control/?xid=homepage), Sanders and Martin O’Malley [met on a stage in Charleston on Sunday night](http://time.com/4181009/democratic-debate-watch-live-stream-free-online/). In the first minutes of the [debate](http://time.com/4183952/democratic-debate-full-text-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/)—which took place just a short walk from the Emanuel A.M.E. Church, where nine African-Americans were shot and killed in June—Clinton ticked off a list of votes that Sanders has taken that she says reflect his alignment with the gun lobby in Washington, D.C. “He has voted with the NRA numerous times,” Clinton said, targeting her opponent. “He voted against the Brady Bill five times. He voted for what we call the Charleston loophole. He voted for immunity for gun manufacturers.” And Clinton ribbed Sanders for changing his views on immunity for gun manufacturers. “I am pleased to hear that Sen. Sanders has reversed his position on immunity,” she said. **Read more**: [_Hillary Clinton Hits Bernie Sanders Hard on Guns_](http://time.com/4183978/democratic-debate-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-guns/) Sanders struck back, calling Clinton’s attacks unfair, and touted his own record. “I think that what Secretary Clinton says is very disingenuous,” Sanders said. “I have a D-minus rating from the NRA. I stood up to the gun lobby and came out and maintained the position that in this country we should not be selling military-style assault weapons. I have supported from day one instant background checks.” “This should not be political issue: what we should be doing is working together,” Sanders said. **Read more**: [_The Full Text of the Fourth Democratic Debate in Charleston_](http://time.com/4183952/democratic-debate-full-text-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/) The candidates’ discussion of healthcare also turned heated, as Clinton criticized [Sanders’ plans](http://time.com/4183856/bernie-sanders-middle-class-taxes-health-care/) for being scattershot and undermining the Affordable Care Act. “When you’re taking about healthcare, the details really matter. We have been raising questions over what the impact would be,” she said. **Read more**: [_Sanders Forces Clinton Into Strong Defense of Obamacare_](http://time.com/4183990/democratic-debate-bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-obamacare/) The three candidates have sparred in past debates, but with the temperature rising and the contenders launching full-frontal attacks against each other regularly on the campaign trail, Sunday night’s contest had a sharper tone. Sanders slammed Clinton on a line of attack that he has until now not used: the former secretary of state’s hundreds of thousands of dollars in speaking fees from Wall Street institutions. In one answer, Sanders lambasted Wall Street’s power in the country and accused Clinton of being under the industry’s influence. “Goldman Sachs was recently fined $5 billion,” Sanders said. “Goldman Sachs has given this country two secretaries of the treasury. The leader of Goldman Sachs is a billionaire who comes to Congress who tells us to cut Social Security. You’ve received over $600,000 in speaking fees from Goldman Sachs in one year,” Sanders concluded, turning to Clinton. Clinton fired back at Sanders, criticizing him for once calling Obama “weak” and “disappointing,” and mentioning Sanders’ call in 2011 to mount a primary challenge against the president. “He’s criticized President Obama for taking money from Wall Street,” Clinton said. **Read more:** [_Watch Bernie Sanders Link Criminal Justice Reform to Wall Street_](http://time.com/4183979/democratic-debate-bernie-sanders-criminal-justice-wall-street/) The stakes on Sunday night were high: the debate was the last before the Iowa caucuses, where Sanders and Clinton are locked in a near-even battle to win the first contest in the Democratic primary. The impression the candidates made on Sunday could presage their performance on Feb. 1; the debate was their final chance to reach a national audience before voting begins. ## Transcript [00:00] Right before the debate you changed your position on [00:02] immunity from law suits for gun manufacturers, can [00:05] you tell us why? << Well, I think Secretary Clinton [00:08] knows that what she says is very disingenuous. I have a [00:12] D minus voting record from the NRA. I [00:16] was in 1988, there were three candidates running for [00:20] congress in the the state of Vermont. I stood up to the [00:23] gun lobby And came out and maintain the position that [00:27] in this country we should not be selling military style [00:31] assault weapons. I have supported from day one and [00:35] instant background check to make certain that people [00:39] who should have not guns, do not have guns and that [00:42] includes people with criminal backgrounds. People [00:45] who are mentally unstable. I support what President [00:48] Obama is doing in terms of trying to close the gun [00:53] show loopholes and I think that it should be a federal [00:55] crime if people act as store men. We have seen in this [00:59] city a horrendous tragedy of a crazed person [01:04] praying. With people and then coming out and shooting [01:07] nine people. This should not be a political issue. What [01:11] we should be doing is working together. And by the [01:14] way, it's a Senator from a rural state that has virtually [01:18] no gun control. I believe that I am in an excellent [01:22] position to bring people together to fight for sensible [01:26] concept [ CROSSTALK ] The question that you did your [01:27] changed your position On immunity for gun [01:28] manufacturers so can you answer the question [01:28] [ UNKNOWN ]? What I have said [01:34] is that the gun manufacturers liability bill had [01:38] some good provisions. Among other things we [01:41] prohibited ammunition that would have killed cops [01:46] who had protection on. We had child safety protection [01:50] on guns in that legislation And what we also say, is [01:55] a small mom and pop gun shop who sells a [01:59] gun legally to somebody should not be held liable if [02:03] somebody does something terrible with that gun. What [02:05] I said is I would relook at it, we get a relook at it, and I [02:10] would support stronger provisions. 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