First lady Michelle Obama and David Letterman on the set of "“Late Show with David Letterman" in New York City on April 30, 2015.
John Paul Filo—AP

Even the president and his first lady, it seems, are not immune to the terror of teenage hormones.

Michelle Obama stopped by The Late Show on Thursday and commiserated with David Letterman over the “cloud” that sometimes passes over his 11-year-old son, Harry. “All of a sudden, all we do is argue and reason escapes the planet!”

“Yeah, you’re in that phase,” replied Michelle, assuring him that it does go away, but that she’s currently dealing with that situation in the White House – but wouldn’t confirm whether it was Malia, 16, or Sasha, 13.

“We have one who generally stays here,” she said, holding her hand flat out in front of her, “and one we call our ‘Grumpy Cat.’ Our ‘Salty Biscuit.’ You just never know what you’re gonna get from that one!”

The first lady also shared that Malia recently obtained her driver’s license – and that it’s a great way to get her to run errands.

As Letterman pointed out, there’s nothing like raising children in the White House to add to the pressure of parenting. However, “we treat them normally,” said Michelle. “We don’t let our circumstance become an excuse for them.”

“See, I do,” Letterman joked. “My son thinks he’s being raised in the White House.”

This article originally appeared on People.com.

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